In Conversation with David Rooker

Welcome, David! Let’s start with a short introduction. Who are you and what do you do, exactly?
Okay! My name is David Rooker, I am 20 years old, and I am a singer-songwriter. I study Media and Culture at Utrecht University, I followed a lot of interesting courses and am now writing my thesis. I also make dark-alternative-pop type of music. I started releasing songs in March this year and have been working on an album for a couple of years now, which I just finished last September.

How did you get into making music? 
It kind of started in phases. I started playing the piano at 10 years old and learned the guitar at 14. So, it all built up until I just started writing my own songs. I was around 12 then. The songs were stories that I just came up with. I have always had a lot of imagination, so the songs did not necessarily revolve around the daily life of a 12-year-old. 

Do you remember one of those songs? 
Well, I remember that my family and I always went to church on Sunday. There was one particular biblical story that I found interesting, so I used it as a basis for one of my stories. I found that funny.

Did you inherit a passion for music from your parents?
Basically, yes. My father has been playing guitar since his childhood and has always dreamed about making his own music, so that’s funny. My mother sings and my little brother plays the bass guitar. We all listen to a lot of music and we are all passionate about it!

Who inspires you when writing and making music?
A lot of musicians. I like the sound of Chris Cornell, who is a singer from Soundgarden, he also released some cool solo stuff. There’s also Nick Drake, these two artists really fit within my own genre. With that said, there are also musicians that you would not really expect, such as Arabian music. I listen to Abdel Halim Hafez, whose music I also find inspiring.

At what point did you realise you wanted to pursue a music career?
I think around the age of 15. Of course, I had already written some songs before that which were fine. But when I was 15 I wrote a specific song — which is on the album in an updated version — that I believe perfectly captured my own sound. My enthusiasm was sparked because of that song: I played it during a high school performance and everyone loved it. I posted the song as a demo online for two years, but then removed it because I wanted to release an improved version for the new album. But yeah, I immediately knew the song was authentic and everyone liked it. Because of this song I thought: well, this has to be it. I was always enthusiastic about music, but the song felt like a switch was turned on. 

Music was just a hobby, at first?
Yeah, I had simply never thought about it before. I wanted to work at a radio station for a while, so I helped at a local broadcasting channel. I was already working with music by then. While I also enjoyed broadcasting,  due to the song I wrote I was sure I wanted to pursue music.

You mentioned a new single you released not too long ago. Will the single be on the album that will be released soon?
No, it won’t. I wanted first to release an EP with four songs, and I wanted the songs to be part of the album. The album was already finished, so I simply chose the four most approachable songs to be released first. Basically, I wanted to release the entire album back in August but was advised against it because I needed to build up a fanbase before making such a statement. An album is a big thing, containing 12 whole songs. Coincidentally, I had already started working on my second EP with bonus tracks. I have decided to include the new single in it and release this EP early, before the original one. The full EP will be released in January or February. So, while the EP was supposed to consist of bonus tracks, it has become its own thing.

Is there anything else you could tell us about Sail with Me? How did it come to be or what was your thought process behind the song?
Yes, the song had kind of a funny process. It was three years back or so and I was at a friend’s place. He’s more into pop music and wanted to get into writing songs himself, so I suggested that we created a track together. I started by playing the piano and actually ended up writing the entire thing. Afterwards, we considered whether or not my friend could still use it, but he isn’t really interested in releasing his own music anymore. I eventually realised that I liked the track, but it didn’t really fit into my ‘sound’ as I usually make more experimental stuff and this was a four-chord-song, making it a little more accessible. Because I started to write other songs that were more accessible, I started to think that it actually does fit within my style! Sometime during the summer I tried playing it on the guitar and added a few things, which made it work pretty well. When I played it live everyone seemed really enthusiastic. People singled out this song, going: “that song is really beautiful!” making me realise it should actually be the first one to be released. 

What does your writing process look like?
That changes every time. There are different ways, sometimes I’ll have something in my head and I’ll simply record it by humming the melody, a riff, or something like that. And then I’ll start to sing over it, after that the song usually takes shape pretty quickly. What I also do often is refer to this list I have with all sorts of things that make me think “Oh, this would make for a cool song title.” So when I write a piece of music I would go back to it and think “this might be a good song title for this!” Because I’ll have a title, I’ll start singing again, which allows me to match things quickly, creating something that gets stuck in my head. That’s something I use a lot as well.

Does that mean that the theme of a song kind of follows the title?
Yes, that’s often the case. When I do this, I usually don’t have a text yet. I’ll have some sort of melody with a particular vibe, and I’ll realise “this title would fit pretty well!” Then, I’ll just try that, and if that works out, the text will flow by itself, then a melody joins in. Aside from that, it’s all very intuitive, I guess. Things will pop up in my head and I’ll play them a lot, that’s when you know it’s got potential.

If I’m not mistaken, all of your current songs are in English even though you are Dutch. Why did you choose to make this decision?
Yes, and it’ll generally stay that way, by the way. English just comes to me the easiest aside from Dutch, of course. I speak French relatively well, but when it comes to writing French texts they might be less creative, or less easily so. Dutch feels… I’m just not entirely sure if it’ll fit with everything — well, not everything — but a lot of the music I enjoy and within this type of style are often in English. I’ve written some things in Dutch, but as most of the things I’ve ever written are in English, I think this choice just feels logical. You can also reach more people that way, even though nowadays that’s also possible with Dutch — you can become big with Dutch music as well. That’s a little harder to do, though, especially with this type of music.

So you’d like to go international?
Yes, I hope so, ideally. Well, now, in the Netherlands, I’ve made a great start, but at some point — and I think this is still true — my music was listened to in other countries as well, so… 

Do you know where? Are you able to see that? 
Yes, at one point there were a lot of listeners from the United States, which is pretty cool. There was a little bit of Scandinavia and Turkey, which I focused on quite a lot, because I know — I saw many Turkish playlists, and they often love this type of dark, melancholy music. I thought that’s something I could tap into as well.

How do you think you reached those people? Do you think they just came across your music?
I’m not entirely sure, but at some point I did place a couple of advertisements that targeted that direction a lot more; I’ve approached many things like music websites and playlists in that general direction. Or like the United States, indeed. An example would be a playlist that gets listened to over there a lot.

So you’re very focused on spreading your music?
Yes, there are artists who are huge in the Netherlands, but not at all abroad. That seems like a bit of a waste to me. Even though my music has proved to be accessible, it’s not very mainstream, I think — not something you’d see at the Vrienden van Amstel Live. I don’t think you can become that big in the Netherlands anymore. Besides, I think my music is just more of an international sound.

You’ve mentioned that your music is quite melancholic, and that it contains an emotional element. Where do you get all these emotions from to write such music?
I was thinking that my music forms quite the contrast to myself. I don’t necessarily think I'm a very emotional type of person nor have I experienced something really traumatic. I just think that all people express their emotions differently; for me, it’s in my music. Sometimes I do think I’m less emotionally expressive, but I try to convey my feelings in my music a little more.

You were also number one on the “Verrukkelijke 15” list from radio NPO2 for three weeks. How was that for you?
Yeah, that was really beautiful and very unexpected too. They mailed me sometime in the summer that they were going to play my number on the station, which was incredible. I didn’t even expect that, because before they told me the number was doing good but on a very small scale. When they eventually played my song, I received a lot of enthusiastic comments. At one point, the number got submitted for the Verrukkelijke 15 list and it got in! In that first week we asked everyone we knew to vote for the song, but eventually the people just started voting themselves. Comments came in from people saying that they liked the song, which was great. It got the number one spot, too! I didn’t even know if we were going to make it, but at last we did. It's less popular now, but it [the Verrukkelijke 15] has existed since the 80s or something and it’s a pretty long list, so it still has some prestige. 

How was it to play live on the radio?
It was awesome. It felt abstract too somehow, because at the moment you’re in the studio with just a DJ and a few sound technicians. But after the show you can listen back and see how you performed, then you get all these lovely reactions that make you realise that you just performed live on radio NPO2. It’s an incredible opportunity.

What would you say is your favourite moment in your music career so far?
Oh… there are a lot of things, actually. One of my favourites was when I first released my EP. The day prior we played in dB’s in Utrecht with 3voor12 which was amazing. Then, of course, there was radio week. Besides the radio NPO2 opportunity, I also got to be at Veronica a few days before that. They played my number there too, so that was quite a lot in a few days.

How do you feel about the Dutch music industry? Did you feel welcomed?
To a certain degree I did feel welcomed. On the one hand, when you’re starting out and they like your work, then people are prepared to give you opportunities. But on the other hand, I’ve noticed you do have to do a lot of work. Luck also plays a part in it, of course. The radio NPO2 situation opened a lot of doors for me. Right now, I have connections with a lot of people — which is great — but it still is difficult to create something that sticks, with a fanbase and such. 

You do have to put in a lot of time and energy.
Yes, for sure, it is something that has been difficult for a while. It’s one of the reasons why I question if the Dutch industry is truly something for me. There are other countries where my music might connect a bit better. These opportunities were a good first sign, however. And in the end, this track turned out to be quite accessible in style after all.

It’s pretty recent that you’ve been gaining this much traction. The radio performance was about a month ago, right?
It was a bit longer ago than that, I think. We played there at the end of August during the summer, though the song ended up staying until the end of September, which was quite recent indeed. It felt like the start of everything, in a sense. Late September we released a new single which got picked up by the radio quite fast. It was great to see that things kept rolling instead of fizzling out after a single song. It got picked up at other stations as well, like with Spotify. It is something I liked seeing, and of course I hoped that my older songs would eventually get picked up as well. 

The same goes for the new album that is coming out soon, I’m guessing.
Certainly, I learned to resist the temptation of releasing everything at once. Sometimes, it’s good to wait until you’ve grown a bit of an audience; those people are the ones that are looking forward to your new material the most.

You are a third-year university student in Utrecht as well, how has it been balancing music and school, especially with writing your thesis?
It’s not so bad now because I am writing less music. At first I was a bit strict with myself and I would say things like, “I need this amount of songs per month.” The past year I was writing way less than before and felt like I needed to write more, I almost got angry at myself. But right now there are a lot of songs prepared and ready, there is a whole album I am waiting to release. There are about 13 songs that haven’t been released yet, and they’re good songs. I want to achieve a certain level of quality in my songs that’s definitely in me to be able to create. Now, I am more accepting of myself when the writing doesn’t happen immediately, it even fuels me to write faster. If I have something then I will work on it for a bit, I think that when you give yourself some rest the writing will come naturally. I am able to do that now that the album is ready. I do have some ideas for my second album already, but I am leaving those for later. So, yes, resting helps. 

So you try to go with the flow?
Yes, that’s something I’ve always tried to do. But I had a bit of a conflict because I always wanted to be productive. That went okay at first, but at a certain point it gets more difficult when I have 15 songs ready and I want the same sort of unique sound in all of them. I am more free in that now, though. I allow myself to have more time between songs.

Has one of your courses been helpful in your music career?
I don’t think so for Media and Culture courses…

Actually, why did you pick Media and Culture if you knew you wanted to pursue a music career? 
I didn’t want to do a music course. I wanted to have a plan B, something next to it. So I thought I could pick something close to me, and it ended up being this. In hindsight I’m not sure if this was the right major for me. There were a lot of fun classes, but also many that were too similar to each other, which did not benefit me that much. I followed a few music courses this year, which were much more focused on theory. I also took some history classes which, again, weren’t too useful for me. But I did choose a film music class in which I learned a lot of interesting things. That made me think, “oh, I can use it in this way for my music,” even though I don’t make any film music. Well, I did write something for a short film earlier this year, which was cool. That was before I followed the course, but it was a fun project nonetheless.

Between your study and your music career, which one would you pick?
I’m relieved that I’m almost done, but I have always wanted to have that piece of paper with my degree on it. If my music explodes, of course I would try to finish my study, but my music is definitely first. This hasn’t been a problem yet, thankfully. When I do have that diploma, however, I am going to go all in with the music.

Are you doing another study after this, or will you take a break? 
I think I will take a half-year break, at the least. After that, I might want to do a masters, though I don’t know in what major yet. I hope that by that time it is not necessary anymore because my music has exploded. But if that hasn’t happened yet then, yes, I will do a master’s degree. I could do it part-time, but I haven’t figured out all of my plans yet. I will definitely finish my thesis first and then take that half-year break. After that, I will have to see for myself.

What is your wish for the future? If everything goes right, where would you be?
I hope to have a beautiful music career. Not just one song that’s known, but a steady career with loyal fans. It doesn't have to be big, but I do have some songs that I think have the potential to be popular one day. I also just want to play live, that’s when it's nice to have that loyal fan base. It doesn’t have to be big in numbers or a lot of streams, as long as I can live off of it and I can perform. That would be a nice thing to do, I think.

So your passion lies with performing?
Yes, mostly. I enjoy writing songs, but the nicest part is when you’re performing live and you can see your audience face to face; to create a real experience. But I enjoy both, really.

Is anything new coming out soon?
The album is going to take a while, so that’s coming out in autumn next year. There will be an EP released with 5 songs at the start of 2024. The first single has already been released, and the second one is coming out at the end of November or the beginning of December. So quite soon!

Thank you so much for this interview! We’re looking forward to hearing your new music.
Thank you! I’m looking forward to reading the next BLIK edition.